Horde removal in version 108
Horde support will be removed from cPanel & WHM starting with Version 108. This is because Horde does not support PHP 8.x, and PHP 7.4 reaches End of Life in November 2022.
What does this mean for me or my customers that use Horde?
Our Webmail offering will be focused on Roundcube going forward. Your email will be available in Roundcube just as it is in Horde today.
What do I need to do to prepare for this?
Nothing currently. We are currently working on tools that will migrate current Horde calendar and contacts data to Roundcube and Roundcube + CCS. We will have more information available once those tools are ready.
What about my calendars and contacts?
We will be providing migration tools that will help Horde users move to Roundcube. We will have more information on those at a later date.
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@Hedloff - those are the reasons that 108 hasn't been moved to Stable just yet, and are being addressed by the team behind the scenes. 0 -
@Hedloff - case CPANEL-42200 has been created for the duplicated calendar events. 0 -
I just did a new test again on this. First time the migration didn't end well, but that was because RoundCube was using MySQL and not SQLite. So this time I converted all accounts to SQLite first. But the upgrade to version 108 should do this automatically, convert RC from MySQL to SQLite before export/import of calendars/contacts. Everything I tested was exported/imported, but noticed some bugs:
- Address book was imported, but they are all in the same address book. Not in 2 as they were in Horde.
- Calendar events were duplicated. So all events were migrated to RC, but they are all duplicates. This must be fixed and should be easy to fix before releasing the version.
- Calendar events were given a new creation date/time. Not sure this can fixed in an easy way and that's not that important either. But if it can be fixed it would be great.
Hello @Hedloff Thank you for this report. I'm the new Product Owner for the team that is performing this work, I've put the case that @cPRex opened on the team's backlog, but I did want to get clarity on the first bullet you have here:- Address book was imported, but they are all in the same address book. Not in 2 as they were in Horde.
Can you expand on this? I'm curious about the use case for having multiple address books for a cPanel user. What makes this a necessary feature, as shared contacts are not a function that Roundcube supports right now I'm trying to understand how important this feature is. Thanks!0 -
Can you expand on this? I'm curious about the use case for having multiple address books for a cPanel user. What makes this a necessary feature, as shared contacts are not a function that Roundcube supports right now I'm trying to understand how important this feature is.
I have never used it myself and don't think many customers use many different address books in Horde either. So I don't think you should use too much energy on that. But for " Calendar events were given a new creation date/time." it would be better to get fixed. What about recurring events for example? Would be great if you got fixed CPANEL-42200 asap, then we will upgrade all servers and get Horde removed.0 -
I have never used it myself and don't think many customers use many different address books in Horde either. So I don't think you should use too much energy on that. But for " Calendar events were given a new creation date/time." it would be better to get fixed. What about recurring events for example? Would be great if you got fixed CPANEL-42200 asap, then we will upgrade all servers and get Horde removed.
Thanks for that, we are working on the other issues, and I can let you know here when they are resolved. I just wanted to understand the multiple address book concern better to make sure we weren't missing something that was important. Thank you!0 -
We did some more testing on CPANEL-42200 issue and seems like it's just showing duplicates in RoundCube, not in Thunderbird or other CalDAV clients such as Android. 0 -
Hello @cPanelLauren, What makes this a necessary feature, as shared contacts are not a function that Roundcube supports right now I'm trying to understand how important this feature is.
We have customers who use the shared address book in Horde and this is going to be a regression if we don't have it when v108 ships. I already informed the support about it a while back (request #94491459) but I'm not sure it made its way to your backlog. Could you confirm shared contacts and shared calendars will indeed be available in v108's Roundcube? Sorry for the message if it's not relevant, but I prefer to be safe than sorry; my understanding of your message made me think shared contacts were not supported. Thanks!0 -
Hello @cPanelLauren, We have customers who use the shared address book in Horde and this is going to be a regression if we don't have it when v108 ships. I already informed the support about it a while back (request #94491459) but I'm not sure it made its way to your backlog. Could you confirm shared contacts and shared calendars will indeed be available in v108's Roundcube? Sorry for the message if it's not relevant, but I prefer to be safe than sorry; my understanding of your message made me think shared contacts were not supported. Thanks!
Hello, You'll still be able to share calendars with CCS but the functionality that allowed shared address books goes away with the horde removal. I realize that is not the best news, but unfortunately, we had no choice but to remove horde due to lack of new development including the support of modern versions of PHP. We are looking to include this functionality moving forward but I cannot guarantee it.0 -
Hello, You'll still be able to share calendars with CCS but the functionality that allowed shared address books goes away with the horde removal. I realize that is not the best news
This regression will certainly cause headaches and cPanel always insisted calendar and contacts will be migrated:What do I need to do to prepare for this? Nothing currently. We are currently working on tools that will migrate current Horde calendar and contacts data to Roundcube and Roundcube + CCS. We will have more information available once those tools are ready.
But that's sadly not the case : ( Also, I'm not the lead developer on the project but I know you can connect CardDAV to Roundcube, eg. with the roundcube/carddav package. I would really appreciate you consider taking the necessary steps to keep the "business as usual" promise when switching to Roundcube. Last but not least, I understand cPanel uses a specific PHP version but could you consider using Cloudlinux's supported PHP version for users who have Cloudlinux to be able to keep Horde? I understand that would require some changes, at least, that would prevent a regression and buy your team more time to deliver on the promise. Thanks : )0 -
Hello, This regression will certainly cause headaches and cPanel always insisted calendar and contacts will be migrated: But that's sadly not the case : ( Also, I'm not the lead developer on the project but I know you can connect CardDAV to Roundcube, eg. with the roundcube/carddav package. I would really appreciate you consider taking the necessary steps to keep the "business as usual" promise when switching to Roundcube. Last but not least, I understand cPanel uses a specific PHP version but could you consider using Cloudlinux's supported PHP version for users who have Cloudlinux to be able to keep Horde? I understand that would require some changes, at least, that would prevent a regression and buy your team more time to deliver on the promise. Thanks : )
Calendars and Contacts will be migrated, and sharing calendars will still function. The only feature that will no longer be usable is shared contacts. We are looking at the possibility of including this functionality within CCS or Roundcube, but it will not be immediate, and I hesitate to make promises in that area. I do understand that this is something that is important to you and many others. It was a business decision to stop using Horde for the reasons I listed above. Without taking into account the potential vulnerability of its PHP support (and lack thereof), there is also the fact that the product is no longer under active development, meaning any issues or problems with it will not be resolved, including security concerns, we cannot in good conscience continue to support the product.0 -
Calendars and Contacts will be migrated, and sharing calendars will still function. The only feature that will no longer be usable is shared contacts. We are looking at the possibility of including this functionality within CCS or Roundcube, but it will not be immediate, and I hesitate to make promises in that area. I do understand that this is something that is important to you and many others. It was a business decision to stop using Horde for the reasons I listed above. Without taking into account the potential vulnerability of its PHP support (and lack thereof), there is also the fact that the product is no longer under active development, meaning any issues or problems with it will not be resolved, including security concerns, we cannot in good conscience continue to support the product.
I would also like to vote for the shared address book feature. At this time, the users for my organization use it via email clients like Thunderbird, and find it very useful to store contacts that would be useful to the entire organization. At the least, it serves as a directory of users in the organization. Please include this functionality within Roundcube.0 -
Calendars and Contacts will be migrated,...
I just allowed the update to 108 on my server and unfortunately, the address book migration doesn't appear to have worked. In my own email account, both "Personal Addresses" as well as "Imported Contacts" are empty. There are several contacts in "Collected Recipients," perhaps from a few of the emails I've sent today? (I haven't set any emails since the update to 108 and removal of Horde). Should I attempt the "Migrate Horde contacts" procedure mentioned in this article?0 -
I'm curious about the use case for having multiple address books for a cPanel user. What makes this a necessary feature, as shared contacts are not a function that Roundcube supports right now I'm trying to understand how important this feature is.
Here is how I and people in my organization use multiple address books: 1. Personal address book to store contacts relevant to that person. 2. Shared address book to store contacts relevant to the organization - customers, vendors I use Thunderbird, and I use the following settings to keep the shared address book up-to-date: This way, the entire team has access to the same address book and are able to initiate / continue a conversation with external entities without having to ask each other to share addresses. I also use the same address book on my Android phone. Happy to provide any more details as needed.0 -
I just allowed the update to 108 on my server and unfortunately, the address book migration doesn't appear to have worked. In my own email account, both "Personal Addresses" as well as "Imported Contacts" are empty. There are several contacts in "Collected Recipients," perhaps from a few of the emails I've sent today? (I haven't set any emails since the update to 108 and removal of Horde). Should I attempt the "Migrate Horde contacts" procedure mentioned in this article?
@aztopdavid Yes and if you experience issues or concerns with this, please contact support. For everyone else who shared feedback: As far as the shared address book concerns - thank you all for those use cases, we definitely are looking to bring shared address books in the future if possible, and your feedback definitely helps solidify that decision for us.0 -
Yes and if you experience issues or concerns with this, please contact support.
I'm a LiquidWeb VPS customer, and my cPanel licensing is handled through them, so am I entitled to contact cPanel support directly, or do I need to start with LiquidWeb support?0 -
It's always best to reach out to the license provider directly for support, but since you have root access to a system you're welcome to contact us too if you'd like. 0 -
We don't have a lot of Horde users but they are certainly some of the loudest. We're watching this subject with concern, particularly if the migration tool isn't 100% per above posts. @cPRex, @cPanelLauren, any idea why there's no obvious information from cPanel about release dates on 108? It's already into Release despite all live docs saying it's in Edge with Current TBD. I pushed all of my shared servers to Stable pending any Horde migration issues with Release, but now I'm thinking I need to disable updates to avoid surprise rollout. Seems suspiciously fast considering it was in Edge for 3 months. Is there a hidden ETA somewhere for when it will hit Stable? 0 -
@jaarons - as you've likely seen me say in other places on the Forum, there is never an ETA available unless I know with certainty something is being released in the very near future. The Horde migration tools are what is keeping 108 from being moved to Stable. Until those are in place and confirmed to be working well, it won't be getting bumped up to Stable. 0 -
I've been experiencing sync issues with my CardDAV Address Books under cPanel v106.0.15 on my Hosting Provider. The ONLY way cPanel provides means for creating the necessary CardDAV URLs required for CardDAV client access (iPhones, Thunderbird, Outlook clients, etc.) is through Horde (using, likely, the Turba plugin). Horde also provides the CardDAV SERVER for cPanel. This capability DOES NOT EXIST in RoundCube, although you can use RoundCube as a CardDAV client using an EXISTING CardDAV server/URL (i.e., Horde, assuming Horde is still running). If you use cPanel's CardDAV/CalDAV URLs, created via Horde, and you update cPanel to the version without Horde, you will lose your ability to sync Address Books and Calendars with clients using DAV. This could be a HUGE issue for enterprises. THIS is a major loss of functionality that cPanel is apparently just now discovering. How is that even possible? cPanel needs to provide a robust CardDAV/CalDAV solution before this version is released. I'd recommend cPanel look at using what Google's CardDAV server uses, since it performs flawlesslessly in the cases where Horde/Turba fails currently (i.e., you can't delete certain fields in a Contact on a Client, only on the Host). Sync is currently fubar and nonexistent in the near future. Great. 0 -
@GrizzlyAK - you could want to install the Calendar and Contacts server as mentioned here:
Except he is a website owner and will not be able to install that :-D0 -
He can poke his host to get it done! 0 -
As former Horde user, I am upset that we are losing it for good. I am not a fan of Roundcube at all. It is too basic & doesn't allow for the same management of emails, little own the Calendar, contacts etc. Can you please look at offering another alternative for those of us that don't like Roundcube? Maybe one of the alternatives such as Rainloop or SOGO could fill Horde's shoes? Sogo would get my vote, since it is in active development. 0 -
@galaxysurfer - we're sad about losing Horde too. If the creators would have kept up with updates and security issues, we'd be happy to keep it. We are looking into other options for a mail client, but I don't have anything I can officially provide on that work just yet. 0 -
Rainloop works decent, but it is also Very basic. It's seems solid with no issues, so that's a plus! Truthfully, the desktop version of MS Outlook has come a LONG ways. It's all I use anymore. 0 -
All of this discussion about using a different mail client instead of Roundcube assumes that we have mail, calendar, and contacts servers running at the backend. With the movement away from Horde, this is no longer automatic. In my case, the hosting provider has not yet managed to setup CCS at the backend. 0 -
For many years, I accessed the email accounts on my server only using Horde, so when it was removed, I did my best to give Roundcube a chance at winning me over. I liked some of the functionality (once I tweaked the settings), although I miss the option to have attachments stripped as items get filed in Sent. However, the current dealbreaker for me is what appears to be a greatly increased amount of computer memory being used on my Windows 10 PC by keeping a Roundcube tab active in Google Chrome. For several weeks, I experienced increased lag time when switching between active applications on my PC, and while I haven't spent the time to test my theory, I think it could be due to Roundcube. When I switched to having MS Outlook open instead of Roundcube, the phenomenon subsided. Also, when actively processing my inbox in Roundcube, I noticed frequent lags while Roundcube displayed "Loading..." in the lower right-hand corner. I know that could be due to things like the efficiency of the connection to my server or server load, but the load on my VPS is typically below 0.10. As currently configured, I don't have any "Filters" options in my Roundcube settings, but a quick search shows that "ManageSieve" probably needs to be configured in Dovecot in order to enable Sieve filtering options in Roundcube. The option to have messages automatically filtered is pretty important, IMO. Sorry this was a bit long, but for me, the jury is still out on Roundcube. 0 -
ATTN: cpanel roundcube does not have the capabilities required by your clients. roundcube does have a calendar. it can do events ONLY. it does not handle TASKS. this is yet one more reason why no one used roundcube. most of us... speaking for myself had two choices. roundcube or horde. many years ago i was faced this choice decision. roundcube had it's try first, after seeing its capabilities, i was immediately turned off and tried horde. never went back. horde never stopped developing, they stopped getting assistance. this is a large organization with the resources to help. this is a direct link to horde: they have working software, it just needs some help. Horde DOES in fact work with PHP 8.2 help them out with code. assist them, get it ready, so they can release the 6.0 stable version. I am not a die hard horde fan. i just need software that works. roundcube is a toy without batteries. Horde contact Page Robert CEO BrooklynElectronicsGroup these guys have a 'donation' box and sell t-shirts . you don't. contact them and collaborate to get the software running for your clients. 0 -
We don't have any plans to continue to provide support for Horde in the future at this time. 0 -
Hi, how can we disable this message global. every user see these message, this wedo not like, because we get many questions. we do not use horde. " The Horde webmail application has been removed in cPanel & WHM version 108. All Horde email, contacts, and calendars will be automatically migrated to Roundcube. For more information, read our 0
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